Uniden Sentinel missing some CA Trunked systems?


Wayne Smith
 

Uniden friends,

I've been having an issue with the Uniden Sentinel software for a while now.  It concerns two of the systems listed in the CA Trunked section of Radioreference:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?stid=6&tab=trs

Two of the systems listed in RadioReference don't show up in the Sentinel database.  They are:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=6719

and

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9937

These two are the (relatively old) LA County REACT trunked system and the (relatively new) Ventura County trunked system.  Both of these systems are consistently missing from the Sentinel weekly download; however, I can program the systems directly into my SDS 100 and 200 scanners with no problems.  There may be other systems like those as well.

I contacted Uniden support in June of this year.  They weren't aware of the issue upon my call.  They verified the issue and they said they would look into it.  I've seen no change since then.

Both of these systems appear in the download for the EZ-Scan software used for Whistler scanners and program automatically just fine.

Can anybody confirm this anomaly?  Or perhaps the systems are "somewhere else" in the Sentinel database other than where they would ordinarily appear?  Or am I doing something wrong?  Does this occur, routinely or intermittently, with other systems, trunked or conventional?  Or?

Thanks,

Wayne


Joe M.
 

That's easily explained.

Easier one first. The second one has no TGs. Solution:
Add some TGs to RR to make the system monitorable to the scanner.

First one is a Smartnet digital system. Not sure what type of digital that is, but it's not P25 which means it's not supported by the scanner. Same solution: Add some monitorable TGs.

Doing the above both will be usable by Sentinel. If this is not possible, there is no point in Sentinel showing systems you cannot monitor.

Joe M.

On 9/29/2020 4:57 PM, Wayne Smith wrote:
Uniden friends,

I've been having an issue with the Uniden Sentinel software for a while
now. It concerns two of the systems listed in the CA Trunked section of
Radioreference:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?stid=6&tab=trs

Two of the systems listed in RadioReference don't show up in the
Sentinel database. They are:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=6719

and

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9937

These two are the (relatively old) LA County REACT trunked system and
the (relatively new) Ventura County trunked system. Both of these
systems are consistently missing from the Sentinel weekly download;
however, I can program the systems directly into my SDS 100 and 200
scanners with no problems. There may be other systems like those as well.

I contacted Uniden support in June of this year. They weren't aware of
the issue upon my call. They verified the issue and they said they
would look into it. I've seen no change since then.

Both of these systems appear in the download for the EZ-Scan software
used for Whistler scanners and program automatically just fine.

Can anybody confirm this anomaly? Or perhaps the systems are "somewhere
else" in the Sentinel database other than where they would ordinarily
appear? Or am I doing something wrong? Does this occur, routinely or
intermittently, with other systems, trunked or conventional? Or?

Thanks,

Wayne

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Evan Platt
 

Isn't SmartZone the old Analog system?
San Francisco is Smartone, and now for the first time I've noticed
there's digital talkgroups listed there...

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=60

On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 3:01 PM Joe M. <mch@nb.net> wrote:

That's easily explained.

Easier one first. The second one has no TGs. Solution:
Add some TGs to RR to make the system monitorable to the scanner.

First one is a Smartnet digital system. Not sure what type of digital
that is, but it's not P25 which means it's not supported by the scanner.
Same solution: Add some monitorable TGs.

Doing the above both will be usable by Sentinel. If this is not
possible, there is no point in Sentinel showing systems you cannot monitor.

Joe M.

On 9/29/2020 4:57 PM, Wayne Smith wrote:
Uniden friends,

I've been having an issue with the Uniden Sentinel software for a while
now. It concerns two of the systems listed in the CA Trunked section of
Radioreference:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?stid=6&tab=trs

Two of the systems listed in RadioReference don't show up in the
Sentinel database. They are:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=6719

and

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9937

These two are the (relatively old) LA County REACT trunked system and
the (relatively new) Ventura County trunked system. Both of these
systems are consistently missing from the Sentinel weekly download;
however, I can program the systems directly into my SDS 100 and 200
scanners with no problems. There may be other systems like those as well.

I contacted Uniden support in June of this year. They weren't aware of
the issue upon my call. They verified the issue and they said they
would look into it. I've seen no change since then.

Both of these systems appear in the download for the EZ-Scan software
used for Whistler scanners and program automatically just fine.

Can anybody confirm this anomaly? Or perhaps the systems are "somewhere
else" in the Sentinel database other than where they would ordinarily
appear? Or am I doing something wrong? Does this occur, routinely or
intermittently, with other systems, trunked or conventional? Or?

Thanks,

Wayne


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Joe M.
 

Yes, it is, and it might be VSELP digital.

Regardless, it's not a system that appears to be accurately
listed. Half of the TGs are also listed as encrypted.

Joe M.

On 9/29/2020 8:13 PM, Evan Platt wrote:
Isn't SmartZone the old Analog system?
San Francisco is Smartone, and now for the first time I've noticed
there's digital talkgroups listed there...

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=60

On Tue, Sep 29, 2020 at 3:01 PM Joe M. <mch@nb.net> wrote:

That's easily explained.

Easier one first. The second one has no TGs. Solution:
Add some TGs to RR to make the system monitorable to the scanner.

First one is a Smartnet digital system. Not sure what type of digital
that is, but it's not P25 which means it's not supported by the scanner.
Same solution: Add some monitorable TGs.

Doing the above both will be usable by Sentinel. If this is not
possible, there is no point in Sentinel showing systems you cannot monitor.

Joe M.

On 9/29/2020 4:57 PM, Wayne Smith wrote:
Uniden friends,

I've been having an issue with the Uniden Sentinel software for a while
now. It concerns two of the systems listed in the CA Trunked section of
Radioreference:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?stid=6&tab=trs

Two of the systems listed in RadioReference don't show up in the
Sentinel database. They are:

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=6719

and

https://www.radioreference.com/apps/db/?sid=9937

These two are the (relatively old) LA County REACT trunked system and
the (relatively new) Ventura County trunked system. Both of these
systems are consistently missing from the Sentinel weekly download;
however, I can program the systems directly into my SDS 100 and 200
scanners with no problems. There may be other systems like those as well.

I contacted Uniden support in June of this year. They weren't aware of
the issue upon my call. They verified the issue and they said they
would look into it. I've seen no change since then.

Both of these systems appear in the download for the EZ-Scan software
used for Whistler scanners and program automatically just fine.

Can anybody confirm this anomaly? Or perhaps the systems are "somewhere
else" in the Sentinel database other than where they would ordinarily
appear? Or am I doing something wrong? Does this occur, routinely or
intermittently, with other systems, trunked or conventional? Or?

Thanks,

Wayne


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Bryan Herbert
 

Motorola Type II Smartnet is a mixed system that supports analog FM and P25 Phase 1 digital. Its been supported by every trunktracking scanner made in the last 20 years.

On Tuesday, September 29, 2020, Joe M. <mch@...> wrote:

First one is a Smartnet digital system. Not sure what type of digital that is, but it's not P25 which means it's not supported by the scanner.


Joe M.
 

Yes, P25 is listed. I missed that before. I didn't remember that
Type II supported that, as Type II systems are becoming obscure.

Regardless, there is something wrong that it's not being imported.

Then again, since it hasn't changed in over 10 years, just add
those 5 frequencies and two TGs to a FL and be done with it.

Joe M.

On 9/29/2020 8:35 PM, Bryan Herbert wrote:
Motorola Type II Smartnet is a mixed system that supports analog FM and
P25 Phase 1 digital. Its been supported by every trunktracking scanner
made in the last 20 years.

On Tuesday, September 29, 2020, Joe M. <mch@nb.net <mailto:mch@nb.net>>
wrote:


First one is a Smartnet digital system. Not sure what type of
digital that is, but it's not P25 which means it's not supported by
the scanner.



--
Bryan Herbert - KE6ZGP
Las Vegas, NV DM26jc USA
https://twitter.com/ke6zgp
https://facebook.com/bryanherbert
https://www.instagram.com/ke6zgp




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Jim Walls
 

On 09/29/2020 20:01, Joe M. wrote:
Yes, P25 is listed. I missed that before. I didn't remember that
Type II supported that, as Type II systems are becoming obscure.
SmartZone can be analog only, digital only, or mixed mode.

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


richard@...
 

Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.

Yes, P25 is listed. I missed that before. I didn't remember that Type
II supported that, as Type II systems are becoming obscure.
SmartZone can be analog only, digital only, or mixed mode.
Sy
--
73
-------------------------------------TI zunifrn
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


Joe M.
 

Rebanding is simple:

1. Program the system frequencies 15 MHz lower.
(866-869 goes to 851-854)

2. If it's a non-P25 system, add the rebanding tables.

That is all you need to do.

Are you sure they did not do more than rebanding?
Such as change to a new system?

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 1:50 PM, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.


Jim Walls
 

On 10/04/2020 10:50, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?
If Radio Reference does not have current data, you will need to manually enter the correct data.  Next step is getting the correct data.  Since you used to work there, maybe you have contacts that can obtain current information for you.
Can't say that I have tried to listen to Orange County since they re-banded.  Mine likely needs to be touched as well...

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


richard@...
 

Did I see you have an 818 #? I ask because I don't want to repeat what you already know. We were in the area that had to switch some frequencies with Nextel. At that same time the Countywide System was nearing 10 years old. Each organization in the County that is a stake holder had to put in their share of the infrastructure cost. Nextel paid its share of the total cost. The stakeholders opted to update the entire system including handhelds, base stations and our share of the system front end including, antennas, microwaves. I retired near the end of planning.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Uniden.groups.io <main@Uniden.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joe M.
Sent: Sunday, October 4, 2020 10:59 AM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Uniden Sentinel missing some CA Trunked systems?

Rebanding is simple:

1. Program the system frequencies 15 MHz lower.
(866-869 goes to 851-854)

2. If it's a non-P25 system, add the rebanding tables.

That is all you need to do.

Are you sure they did not do more than rebanding?
Such as change to a new system?

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 1:50 PM, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.


richard@...
 

I have the current database as does the Uniden site. What I am/was missing is the instructions you sent. I know the database is out there since all the critical channels are encrypted and those frequencies are out on the web too..

Thanks for your help.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Uniden.groups.io <main@Uniden.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jim Walls
Sent: Sunday, October 4, 2020 11:48 AM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Uniden Sentinel missing some CA Trunked systems?

On 10/04/2020 10:50, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?
If Radio Reference does not have current data, you will need to manually enter the correct data. Next step is getting the correct data. Since you used to work there, maybe you have contacts that can obtain current information for you.
Can't say that I have tried to listen to Orange County since they re-banded. Mine likely needs to be touched as well...


--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


Joe M.
 

Not sure what an 818# means. If you mean a frequency of 818 MHz, that is an input frequency and is not used on scanners. Use the output of 863.

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 2:23 PM, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Did I see you have an 818 #? I ask because I don't want to repeat what you already know. We were in the area that had to switch some frequencies with Nextel. At that same time the Countywide System was nearing 10 years old. Each organization in the County that is a stake holder had to put in their share of the infrastructure cost. Nextel paid its share of the total cost. The stakeholders opted to update the entire system including handhelds, base stations and our share of the system front end including, antennas, microwaves. I retired near the end of planning.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Uniden.groups.io <main@Uniden.groups.io> On Behalf Of Joe M.
Sent: Sunday, October 4, 2020 10:59 AM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Uniden Sentinel missing some CA Trunked systems?

Rebanding is simple:

1. Program the system frequencies 15 MHz lower.
(866-869 goes to 851-854)

2. If it's a non-P25 system, add the rebanding tables.

That is all you need to do.

Are you sure they did not do more than rebanding?
Such as change to a new system?

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 1:50 PM, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.











Joel Kahn
 

Richard:

Looking at the Radioreference data for Orange County

It appears that almost all talk groups- Law Enforcement and Fire are encrypted which means that no scanner can legally hear these communications.

The exception looks like Anaheim and most area's public works have some unencrypted T/G.

Joel

Comme dicté à mon chat et envoyé de mon ordinateur de bureau.
(As dictated to my cat and sent from my desktop computer.)



On Sunday, October 4, 2020, 01:56:23 PM EDT, richard@... <richard@...> wrote:


Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System.  I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden.  They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database.  I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded.  We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.

> Yes, P25 is listed. I missed that before. I didn't remember that Type
> II supported that, as Type II systems are becoming obscure.

SmartZone can be analog only, digital only, or mixed mode.
        Sy
--
73
-------------------------------------TI zunifrn
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@...
Ofc:  818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395












Joel Kahn
 

FYI Richard

The entire country had to reband to trade cellular frequencies for Public Service frequencies.  I thought that the deadline for this was years ago?

If your 436 was OK'd by Uniden, it means you already have the firmware upgrade that was released to handle the rebanding (or they did it while they had the radio).

I don't think your problem is rebanding, I think it is encryption of talk groups.

Your system has multiple transmitters so you need to have (at least) the control frequencies for towers close to you programmed.  If you do, the radio should periodically stop momentarily (maybe make a garbled noise) and resume scanning when someone transmits on an encrypted talk group.

Joel

Comme dicté à mon chat et envoyé de mon ordinateur de bureau.
(As dictated to my cat and sent from my desktop computer.)





Rick NK7I
 

If memory serves (sometimes it does), OC went encrypted last year.   There was much hue and cry from various sources and OC relented to not use encryption.  However I've not seen any mention of the network being heard since then; some issues between vendor and buyer, it became political, slowing the entire process.

If it is still encrypted, you won't hear anything.  By now, the database should have picked up (and corrected) any change of frequencies.

Regards,
Rick NK7I (N ID)

On 10/4/2020 10:59 AM, Joe M. wrote:
Rebanding is simple:

1. Program the system frequencies 15 MHz lower.
(866-869 goes to 851-854)

2. If it's a non-P25 system, add the rebanding tables.

That is all you need to do.

Are you sure they did not do more than rebanding?
Such as change to a new system?

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 1:50 PM, richard@... wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System.  I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden.  They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database.  I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded.  We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?

Thanks in advance for any assistance you can give.







Joe M.
 

But is that database correct?

Any encrypted channels you will not receive no matter
if the system is programmed correctly or not.

Joe M.

On 10/4/2020 2:59 PM, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
I have the current database as does the Uniden site. What I am/was missing is the instructions you sent. I know the database is out there since all the critical channels are encrypted and those frequencies are out on the web too..

Thanks for your help.

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Uniden.groups.io <main@Uniden.groups.io> On Behalf Of Jim Walls
Sent: Sunday, October 4, 2020 11:48 AM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Uniden Sentinel missing some CA Trunked systems?

On 10/04/2020 10:50, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Once Orange County (Ca) went through the Re-Banding my scanners stopped receiving the Trunked System. I have gone as far as sending one of my scanners in to Uniden. They confirmed that everything was ok an d I have the correct database. I worked in Public Safety in OC during the planning for Re-Banding. The contractors asked all of the users if we had scanners that would need to be upgraded. We included the cost of replacing our scanners just in case. I was retired just as the started to replace radios so this wasn't an issue I got involved in. Has anyone found a fix for this issue on the Uniden BCD436HP?
If Radio Reference does not have current data, you will need to manually enter the correct data. Next step is getting the correct data. Since you used to work there, maybe you have contacts that can obtain current information for you.
Can't say that I have tried to listen to Orange County since they re-banded. Mine likely needs to be touched as well...


--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395












Jim Walls
 

On 10/04/2020 13:10, Joel Kahn wrote:
The entire country had to reband to trade cellular frequencies for Public Service frequencies.  I thought that the deadline for this was years ago?
It was for most of the country.  Orange county California is within the range of the Mexican border that re-banding required treaty negotiations with Mexico.  That took years, so most of the 800 MHz systems in that border area have fairly recently completed their re-banding.

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


Jim Walls
 

On 10/04/2020 13:24, Rick NK7I wrote:
If memory serves (sometimes it does), OC went encrypted last year.   There was much hue and cry from various sources and OC relented to not use encryption.  However I've not seen any mention of the network being heard since then; some issues between vendor and buyer, it became political, slowing the entire process.

Law enforcement on the Orange County system has been encrypted for decades.  When they went P-25, fire got switched to encrypted.  That was not desired even by the fire chiefs, but it took a while to switch back.  I do not know what the status of moving fire back to clear is (I don't normally monitor anything in Orange county).

-- 
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@...
Ofc:  818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395


Jim Walls
 

On 10/04/2020 11:23, richard@labowitz.net wrote:
Did I see you have an 818 #? I ask because I don't want to repeat what you already know.
I assume the reference to 818 # is my phone number listed in my signature.  Yes, my office number is in the 818 area code.  I work in the Radio Shop for the city of Glendale, and am the #2 guy running the I-C-I System in Los Angeles county.

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@k6ccc.org
Ofc: 818-548-4804
http://members.dslextreme.com/users/k6ccc/
AMSAT Member 32537 - WSWSS Member 395