Date   

Re: Encryption

Jeff Kenyon
 

I’ve also been listening since I was a little kid, and fortunately for me all of the places where I’ve lived have been in the clear.  I was at a training center for the blind in Michigan and when I was their the trunked system was a plain old Motorola Type II system.  Now that same agency in the area as well as the other law enforcement coms for the area in general are mostly encrypted.  Here in Rochester on our new trunked system the county has a couple of special ops talkgroups that are encrypted.  People are hoping to move all the way over to the system by the end of the year, and hopefully day to day operations for the city and county stay in the clear.  I take the move date with a grain of salt because this system has been up since about 2012 or 13 and it mostly has been a lot of patching to VHF and UHF stuff, but the patching is starting to increase.


On May 14, 2020, at 6:43 PM, baldwinbob2000 via groups.io <baldwinbob2000@...> wrote:


Yep, I do too.  I'm sure the dude who owns RR doesn't want to hear
that.

I heard a 2+ hours chase a couple years ago and every time a car
would say where he was the guy would turn.  Finally, a cop said, "he's
listening to us."

My first scanner was a Bearcat III so I'd sure hate for it all to go encrypted,
I've been listening for decades.

On Thursday, May 14, 2020, 05:05:37 PM CDT, jeff <jeffm1977@...> wrote:


I still blame the scanner apps on the phones and live feeds. I'm sure criminals love scanner apps. I'm all for encryption, but the normal day to day operations should not be encrypted. Only tac channels, swat, drug enforcement, and other sensitive stuff should be encrypted.


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: harvey@...
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Sent: 2020-05-14 5:08:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Encryption

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

 

K1DJG




Re: Encryption

AC2FV
 

There’s no such thing as secret police until the police start keeping secrets.

Dispatch should be unencrypted, tactical channels should be encrypted. Easy to do in today’s digital world.

PD and Emcomm all say keep alert, watch out for…, be prepared… and then they go silent on dispatch.



Scott Conover 
Email: xtraham@...

Amateur Call: AC2FV
GMRS Call:WQRD399

RACES ID: 2-002
ARES AEC, Town of Huntington
CERT
American Red Cross
SkyWarn: 19-36-NYC


Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Scanner1143
 

You are correct Joe M.
Ruined it here in Mobile County, Al.
Purchased my 536HP with the updates and 5 weeks later they pulled the switch.
Like previous poster stated, Mobile County and City got Federal Grant Money
Harris Radio System got in someone's pocket ( known fact ) and it cost a _____ of a lot.
They over paid.
Now I hear Harris has gone out of that business of Police radios & they are having problems
With the system and they still have not completed all the installations throughout the county.
It's been several years now.

Thomas

-----Original Message-----
From: main@Uniden.groups.io [mailto:main@Uniden.groups.io] On Behalf Of Joe M.
Sent: Thursday, May 14, 2020 2:36 PM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] SDS100 Upgrades?

Encryption is ruining it here too.

My point was that P25, or P25 Phase II, or digital didn't ruin it.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 3:29 PM, Joe Polcari wrote:
Lucky you.

I live in FL and encryption absolutely ruined my hobby.

*From: *<main@Uniden.groups.io> on behalf of "Joe M." <mch@...>
*Reply-To: *<main@Uniden.groups.io>
*Date: *Thursday, May 14, 2020 at 3:24 PM
*To: *<main@Uniden.groups.io>
*Subject: *Re: [Uniden] SDS100 Upgrades?

You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or

narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable

scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:

But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog

trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.

Phase II ruined it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all
of us.


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Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Joe M.
 

That is the biggest reason against encryption - the
loss of those eyes and ears that catch criminals.

Who benefits? The criminals.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 6:43 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:
Any information can be abused. Many years ago, when a terrorist took
several blondes hostage in the Durant Hotel in Berkeley, Ca, the crook
gained intellectual advantage watching the NEWS on TV in Henri's bar in
the hotel. Back then I used a Radio Shack PRO-38 10 channel scanner and
it worked fine. The police on the scene told less than the news
reporters on TV.

These days Berkeley encrypts a couple of their channels. If my town
goes to phase II, I'll need a new scanner, but if they encrypt, like you
said, I'm out of the game. But, I'd love to be able to phone the cops
and say "I see the guy you're looking for hiding under that dump truck
you just passed by".

Stay well.



On Thursday, May 14, 2020, 12:26:35 PM PDT, Joe M. <mch@...> wrote:


You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or
narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable
scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:
>
> But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog
> trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.
> Phase II ruined it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all
of us.




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Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

don robinson
 

Any information can be abused. Many years ago, when a terrorist took several blondes hostage in the Durant Hotel in Berkeley, Ca, the crook gained intellectual advantage  watching the NEWS on TV in Henri's bar in the hotel. Back then I used a Radio Shack  PRO-38 10 channel scanner and it worked fine. The police on the scene told less than the news reporters on TV.

 These days Berkeley encrypts a couple of their channels. If my town goes to phase II, I'll need a new scanner, but if they encrypt, like you said, I'm out of the game. But,  I'd love to be able to phone the cops and say "I see the guy you're looking for hiding under that dump truck you just passed by".

Stay well.



On Thursday, May 14, 2020, 12:26:35 PM PDT, Joe M. <mch@...> wrote:


You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or
narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable
scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:
>
> But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog
> trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.
> Phase II ruined  it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all of us.




Re: Encryption

baldwinbob2000
 

Yep, I do too.  I'm sure the dude who owns RR doesn't want to hear
that.

I heard a 2+ hours chase a couple years ago and every time a car
would say where he was the guy would turn.  Finally, a cop said, "he's
listening to us."

My first scanner was a Bearcat III so I'd sure hate for it all to go encrypted,
I've been listening for decades.

On Thursday, May 14, 2020, 05:05:37 PM CDT, jeff <jeffm1977@...> wrote:


I still blame the scanner apps on the phones and live feeds. I'm sure criminals love scanner apps. I'm all for encryption, but the normal day to day operations should not be encrypted. Only tac channels, swat, drug enforcement, and other sensitive stuff should be encrypted.


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: harvey@...
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Sent: 2020-05-14 5:08:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Encryption

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

 

K1DJG




Re: Encryption

Joe M.
 

This makes perfect sense.

"Gee - there was a burglar in my neighborhood last week - I
should get in my time machine and go back and lock my doors"

I won't even address the "nominal fee" for
information related to your own safety.

The more encryption spreads, the more armed citizens there will be.
I've seen it happen in areas near me. It's too bad the number of untrained will rise, but hey - as long as it's more safe, right?

Sorry, but criminals have no privacy
rights that supersede my safety rights.

In fact, one could argue that protecting their
privacy encourages more criminal activity.
(or was that the intent all along?)

We may as well just replace the news with
game shows due to privacy concerns.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 6:30 PM, Don Curtis wrote:
There are privacy issues that are addressed via encryption. I have been
listening to police calls since the early 60's. I was a Denver Police
officer for 26 years, retired in 1997.

I understand the desire to have dispatch channels in the clear, but I
agree with the need for encryption even on the main dispatch channel.
Authentic news media have always been able to buy radios that are
programed by the safety radio engineers that can decrypt the main
dispatch channel. And pretty much anyone can get (for a nominal fee)
unencrypted audio from past events.



On May 14, 2020 4:05:33 PM "jeff" <jeffm1977@...> wrote:

I still blame the scanner apps on the phones and live feeds. I'm sure
criminals love scanner apps. I'm all for encryption, but the normal
day to day operations should not be encrypted. Only tac channels,
swat, drug enforcement, and other sensitive stuff should be encrypted.


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: harvey@...
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Sent: 2020-05-14 5:08:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Encryption

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who
want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption
wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

K1DJG



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Re: Encryption

Don Curtis <Don.Curtis@...>
 

There are privacy issues that are addressed via encryption.  I have been listening to police calls since the early 60's.  I was a Denver Police officer for 26 years, retired in 1997.

I understand the desire to have dispatch channels in the clear, but I agree with the need for encryption even on the main dispatch channel.   Authentic news media have always been able to buy radios that are programed by the safety radio engineers that can decrypt the main dispatch channel.   And pretty much anyone can get (for a nominal fee) unencrypted audio from past events. 



On May 14, 2020 4:05:33 PM "jeff" <jeffm1977@...> wrote:

I still blame the scanner apps on the phones and live feeds. I'm sure criminals love scanner apps. I'm all for encryption, but the normal day to day operations should not be encrypted. Only tac channels, swat, drug enforcement, and other sensitive stuff should be encrypted.


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: harvey@...
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Sent: 2020-05-14 5:08:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Encryption

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

 

K1DJG





Re: Encryption

jeff
 

I still blame the scanner apps on the phones and live feeds. I'm sure criminals love scanner apps. I'm all for encryption, but the normal day to day operations should not be encrypted. Only tac channels, swat, drug enforcement, and other sensitive stuff should be encrypted.


Sent from Xfinity Connect Application


-----Original Message-----

From: harvey@...
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Sent: 2020-05-14 5:08:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Encryption

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

 

K1DJG




Re: Encryption

Joe M.
 

If it weren't for criminals, there would be no police to monitor. ;->

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 5:08 PM, harvey morse wrote:
As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want
to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption
wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

K1DJG


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Re: Encryption

harvey morse
 

As much as the encryption is hurting us as law abiding citizens who want to hear what is going on, if it weren’t for criminals, encryption wouldn’t be necessary. They should share blame also.

 

K1DJG


Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Joe M.
 

Encryption is ruining it here too.

My point was that P25, or P25 Phase II, or digital didn't ruin it.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 3:29 PM, Joe Polcari wrote:
Lucky you.

I live in FL and encryption absolutely ruined my hobby.

*From: *<main@Uniden.groups.io> on behalf of "Joe M." <mch@...>
*Reply-To: *<main@Uniden.groups.io>
*Date: *Thursday, May 14, 2020 at 3:24 PM
*To: *<main@Uniden.groups.io>
*Subject: *Re: [Uniden] SDS100 Upgrades?

You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or

narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable

scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:

But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog

trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.

Phase II ruined it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all
of us.


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Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Joe Polcari
 

Lucky you.

I live in FL and encryption absolutely ruined my hobby.

 

From: <main@Uniden.groups.io> on behalf of "Joe M." <mch@...>
Reply-To: <main@Uniden.groups.io>
Date: Thursday, May 14, 2020 at 3:24 PM
To: <main@Uniden.groups.io>
Subject: Re: [Uniden] SDS100 Upgrades?

 

You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or

narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

 

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

 

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable

scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

 

Joe M.

 

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:

 

But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog

trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.

Phase II ruined  it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all of us.

 

 

 


Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Joe M.
 

You could say P25 "ruined it", or digital "ruined it", or
narrowbanding "ruined it". Any required newer scanners.

Yes, encryption will ruin it for everyone since upgrades are not legal.

P25 Phase II did not ruin it for me. I purchased a P25 Phase II capable scanner and continue to monitor those areas.

Joe M.

On 5/14/2020 2:50 PM, don robinson via groups.io wrote:

But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog
trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either.
Phase II ruined it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all of us.


Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

don robinson
 


True: P25 was pushed into the US for interoperability, but also because the phone company took away some radio spectrum many radio agencies had been using, including TV. The government grant to get cities into P25 was not enough to really make it work though at first. P25  began as barely operable, but for 10's of millions of dollars more it could be made to work. There also is annual maintenance, costing cities millions per year as well. That is very lucrative for the providers of P25 systems, but some cities choose not to be on the hook for millions more dollars in annual cost to replace something they have that still works well for them. But, for us little guys, it meant replacing our analog trunking scanners with digital trunking scanners- not cheap either. Phase II ruined  it for some of us. Encryption will ruin it for all of us.

Stay well, friends.



It's not just Motorola.  Public safety agencies that are buying digital
radios are STRONGLY encouraged to use the P-25 standard in order to
maintain inter-operability with their neighbors.  To help push that, the
federal government has deemed that if you are going to get federal grant
money to buy radios, it MUST be P-25 capable.
Going into the Way Back machine, when trunking first got started,
largely every manufacturer built their own system.  None were compatible
with each other.  Many years ago, it was realized that this was a
problem.  APCO came together and created the P-25 standard to avoid that
problem in the future.  Granted that radio systems do not get major
updates or replacements on a fast schedule, so it has taken YEARS, but
the vast majority of digital radio systems in use in the USA by public
safety agencies today are P-25. Of course there are lots of agencies
(especially in more rural areas) that are still analog conventional, and
likely will be for a long time.

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@...




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Re: SDS100 Upgrades?

Jim Walls
 

On 05/11/2020 18:00, James F. Boehner, MD via groups.io wrote:
Looks like I need to correct myself-last two paragraphs:

1) Motorola sells "mission critical" radios such as the APX series that uses P25 for public safety and when not encrypted, can be monitored by your scanner without upgrades.

'73 de JIM N2ZZ
It's not just Motorola.  Public safety agencies that are buying digital radios are STRONGLY encouraged to use the P-25 standard in order to maintain inter-operability with their neighbors.  To help push that, the federal government has deemed that if you are going to get federal grant money to buy radios, it MUST be P-25 capable.
Going into the Way Back machine, when trunking first got started, largely every manufacturer built their own system.  None were compatible with each other.  Many years ago, it was realized that this was a problem.  APCO came together and created the P-25 standard to avoid that problem in the future.  Granted that radio systems do not get major updates or replacements on a fast schedule, so it has taken YEARS, but the vast majority of digital radio systems in use in the USA by public safety agencies today are P-25. Of course there are lots of agencies (especially in more rural areas) that are still analog conventional, and likely will be for a long time.

--
73
-------------------------------------
Jim Walls - K6CCC
jim@...


Re: Searching BCD436HP database

Joel Kahn
 

You can use the Sentinel program to look at what is programmed in each of your favorite lists.  

If you find duplicate talk groups, you can "avoid" (lock out) one of them, or you can edit the favorite list and delete the duplicates.

Joel R Kahn

Comme dicté à mon chat et envoyé de mon Android.
(As dictated to my cat and sent from my Android.)



On Monday, May 11, 2020, 10:00:17 AM EDT, sckeith@... <sckeith@...> wrote:


New to the BCD436HP and I was looking but didn't finding anything. Is there a way to search through the scanner database to look for duplicate frequencies?

Thanks


Re: Which one?

KA9QJG
 

The  BC-246  Is a Great little Scanner  I was  forced  to buy the Expensive SDS-100  To hear My Local PD/FD ...On  Mot Phase 2   . I can you this  The 246  Is Much Much better on Close Call and VHF/UHF

 

Happy Scanning 

 

Don KA9QJG

 

From: main@Uniden.groups.io [mailto:main@Uniden.groups.io] On Behalf Of (Maggie/Tom O’Connor)
Sent: Tuesday, May 12, 2020 11:01 PM
To: main@Uniden.groups.io
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Which one?

 

+1 for the BC246!!! Great for analog Trunked AND pretty good on UHF and not so bad on Low Band either! Mine ranks right up there with my BCD346!!  Reception is def better, but not as many features, and obviously no digital.  It’s my go-to though!

 

Sent: Monday, May 11, 2020 9:24 PM

Subject: Re: [Uniden] Which one?

 

I have a BC246 which works great for trunked analog and is no longer made.  If I was going to buy new one today, it would be a BCD325P2.

 

Robert Wichert 
PEng   LEED AP
HERS I/II 2016/2019 #CC2006186
Office: +1 916 966 9060
Mobile: +1 916 712 4481

On 5/11/2020 5:45 PM, pcbutts1 via groups.io wrote:

I will be looking in the near future to buy a new handheld scanner, what’s the best new one out there? And will my stimulus check cover it.

 

 

_._,_._,_


Re: Which one?

Maggie O'Connor
 

+1 for the BC246!!! Great for analog Trunked AND pretty good on UHF and not so bad on Low Band either! Mine ranks right up there with my BCD346!!  Reception is def better, but not as many features, and obviously no digital.  It’s my go-to though!
 

Sent: Monday, May 11, 2020 9:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Uniden] Which one?
 

I have a BC246 which works great for trunked analog and is no longer made.  If I was going to buy new one today, it would be a BCD325P2.

 

Robert Wichert 
PEng   LEED AP
HERS I/II 2016/2019 #CC2006186
Office: +1 916 966 9060
Mobile: +1 916 712 4481
On 5/11/2020 5:45 PM, pcbutts1 via groups.io wrote:

I will be looking in the near future to buy a new handheld scanner, what’s the best new one out there? And will my stimulus check cover it.

 


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Re: Thanks!

Joe M.
 

I should have specified Uniden America. :-)

Joe M.

On 5/12/2020 4:25 PM, Anton Romirer wrote:
In New Zealand and Australia they do...
their full range!

On Wed, 13 May 2020 at 02:50, Joe M. <mch@... <mailto:mch@...>> wrote:

Uniden (Bearcat) does not sell scanners directly to consumers.

Joe M.

On 5/12/2020 10:40 AM, harvey morse wrote:
> I did order my SDS100 from Bearcat, and yes, they are $75 per
upgrade. I
> am going to hold off purchasing the upgrades now, as several of
you have
> given me other sources of acquiring them if needed at a lesser
cost, but
> I am going to let them program several counties that I need to
listen to
> and see what difference there is if any, to a zip code selection.
Thanks
> to all who were kind enough to assist me with your responses. Now
it’s a
> waiting game until Bearcat has them back in stock.
>
> Harvey
>
> K1DJG





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