Re: P25 for Cheap

Donald Lambert <banjodhl@...>

Never is a very long time. Sad to say that if the manufacturers see a big enough profit in it they can buy a dispensation from the F.C.C.

Very little if anything (that I know of) has been done by the F.C.C. to curtail the TV and grow light manufactures products from emitting stray rf being emitted from their products.

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Thought for the week:
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Without CW it's just CB
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Any and all communications herein are the sole property of the email sender and originator. Any electronic intercept of this communication constitutes a violation of 50 U.S.C. § 1861(b)(2) of The Patriot Act. The use of this information in informal or formal proceedings, charges, investigations or indictments is strictly prohibited and rendered null and void if obtained without a warrant."

On Saturday, November 9, 2019, 6:37:03 PM PST, Joe M. <mch@...> wrote:

I agree if by "Won’t be long" you mean "NEVER".

There are a few issues preventing this.

1. The manufacturers will never make decryption available. It would
never pass FCC Type Acceptance for a consumer product since it would
violate FCC rules.

2. The manufacturers will never try to pull one over on the FCC because
they would be making products intended to violate FCC law. Any
manufacturer who tries this will soon be out of business due to FCC
fines which would escalate with each violation. Nobody has pockets that
deep - especially to pacify a bunch of scanner users.

3. Let's say the above is wrong and they can add decryption. You really
think the system owner is going to give YOU the key? Without that, you
can try 1 key per second and still never find the right one in your
lifetime. If it were that simple there would be PC software that would

Again, never gonna happen. Not in a commercial consumer product.

Joe M.

On 11/9/2019 8:11 PM, huntwildturkey8254 via Groups.Io wrote:
> Won’t be long, and scanner companies will be making encrypted radio
> scanners.
>> On Nov 9, 2019, at 19:02, KA9QJG <KA9QJG@...> wrote:
>> Robert  . That was  very well said  I have  been the Communications
>> over 50 yrs  US Navy , Law Enforcement , 911 Dispatcher  and Ham
>> Radio,  I live in N/W Indiana  near Chicago and had to buy tie
>> expensive Uniden SDS-100  Just to hear My local PD/FD  and some is
>> Encrypted ,And I have worked  in Law Enforcement  Yes in some cases it
>> is needed,  But not for general  Communications .. We actually have a
>> few FB groups that are  listen and posting Live incidents with Audio
>> and Video and Pictures  , This is very dangerous and illegal . Also if
>> you  have enough money and want a Motorola APX  radio that the PD use
>> just  go to E bay and other places  some will even program the radios
>> for add  More money and Yes you can get the Encryption too . Just do
>> not get caught Even if the  Scanners  companies  would make  decoders
>> it is still illegal for us to Monitor  unless We are Authorized  by
>> the System administrator  of any system
>> Happy Scanning while We can
>> Don KA9QJG
>> Ps  in Working Law Enforcement and a 911  Communications Dispatcher
>> Many yrs ago  I know of many cases where a Scanner listener have
>> called and helped out many times , one time when We has a Sgt call for
>> help His battery was  almost dead and the Dispatcher  did not hear
>> him,  But a scanner listener a block away did and called the
>> dispatcher and  was able to get him the help he needed  saving his
>> life and  catching the alleged  bad guys ,of course this was the good
>> ol analog days With the New Digital you either  hear it or you don’t
>>  when the battery gets weak…
>> *From:* [] *On Behalf
>> Of *Robert A Klamp
>> *Sent:* Saturday, November 09, 2019 4:42 PM
>> *To:*
>> *Subject:* Re: [Uniden] P25 for Cheap
>> As intriguing as everyone's opinion on encryption is here that fact of
>> the matter. Ever since people started running streaming media of real
>> time police traffic enc use has skyrocketed. Broadcastify and Radio
>> Reference are your two biggest problem in the scanner world. I
>> remember having to go buy a book of all the local frequencies, having
>> to know how to program them into your scanner or radio, then having
>> the know how to distinguish what was being used for what. You had to
>> do it all your self or instead of buying the book you could throw on
>> the attenuator on your radio and drive around your area doing
>> frequency searches and seeing what hits you got. The big problem with
>> everything being one trunked system is everything is repeated there is
>> no more switch to 5 for simplex ops really happening anymore. Well
>> there is but not in very many places (at least where I live) I
>> remember when the biggest most populated county in my listening area
>> was VHF and all the tactical channels were vhf simplex. They have
>> since encrypted everything with AES256 on a county wide trunked
>> systems with a few different sites and multiple towers for each site.
>> The days of just throwing on your scanner and hearing what's going on
>> are pretty dead. Between CAD systems, encryption, cell phones,
>> cellular PTT like zello or worse yet first net, and many other factors
>> are becoming more and more popular. With the UHF T Band give/take back
>> police have less room in a frequency spectrum that was already
>> overcrowded but worked well for big cities it penetrated buildings and
>> other nuisances well and didn't really propagate to much so there was
>> much bleed over from other places half the country away like low band
>> and sometimes vhf have problems with. Then you have broadcastify just
>> spilling public safety radio traffic out for anybody who want it's
>> like oil from a tanker crash. Add that with almost every frequency in
>> use around the country being reported and published on radio reference
>> for any old schmuck to go look up and you start to see the problem. To
>> much info is readily available to the public. When my small area radio
>> monitoring group decided to stop keeping our own records of data in
>> our area and publish it all on radio reference because the owner of
>> that site hasn't made enough money yet exploiting are once exuberant
>> and lively hobby I saw the end sneaking up fast. But it's not my radio
>> clubs fault i blame radio reference and broadcastify were a criminal
>> can tune in clock patrol traffic and anything else they may need to
>> time and commit crimes with little to no resistance from public safety
>> already knowing what to expect. Or have a lookout listening to there
>> it on there smart phone when he used to have to have some kind of
>> skill with radios to listen to what he can now here with a click of a
>> mouse or worse yet an app on his smart phone. And now we have even
>> dumbed down the hobby further by putting the entire radio reference
>> database in the scanner for so all you have to do is download the
>> latest update and put in your zip code and pop everything from police
>> to public safety are preloaded with the latest information from the
>> biggest threat to our hobby. But wait in case you are so radio
>> incompetent that you don't even know how to lock out unwanted channels
>> don't worry you can just select the correct service tags to hear what
>> you want if your a criminal just lock out all but police services if
>> your a fire bug just lock out all but fire. These problems are not
>> going away they are just getting worse as we enable more and more
>> people who didn't have access to these comms easy access everything
>> they could want and use to the disadvantage of the public and public
>> safety. So of course police will encrypt. Fire will encrypt. And even
>> ems will encrypt there is to much much information available that once
>> upon a time was not. The part of this that makes me just sick is there
>> is one man behind it who hands out little freebies to those that help
>> him destroy our hobby while he take the big payday from
>> uniden,Whistler, and users of both his websites. Stop enabling him!
>> And the last thing I will bring up is the communications act of or the
>> communications privacy act of 1986 I believe should cover live
>> streaming  but for some reason that is loop hole. Make streaming
>> illegal and keep what you hear to yourself this used to be common
>> sense but now we have threads on radiorefernce with titles funniest
>> thing heard one scanner, best call heard on a scanner, active
>> emergency ops on your scanner and so on and so forth. When you ask
>> yourself why is my area going encrypted and why is my 700 dollar
>> scanner now a paper weight just do a search of what info is readily
>> available for your area and what people have posted about what they
>> are hearing in your area things should become a little more clear at
>> that point. I have a lot more to say but I will stop there for more
>> information on the legalities of disclosing what I'd heard on your
>> scanner please see the following link.
>> And I know I have upset some people but these are just my thoughts and
>> opinions your allowed to have yours please allow me to have mine,
>> Thank you,
>> Bob
>> Sent from my Verizon, Samsung Galaxy smartphone
>> -------- Original message --------
>> From: Shawn Benoit <shawnbenoit@...>
>> Date: 11/9/19 14:45 (GMT-06:00)
>> To:
>> Subject: Re: [Uniden] P25 for Cheap
>> I'm pro encryption for police and EMS communications. Nothing will
>> change that even though it's a hobby and I like to listen.
>> On Sat, Nov 9, 2019 at 13:09 Joe M. <mch@... <mailto:mch@...>>
>> wrote:
>>    Is that because crime only happens at the
>>    police station and doesn't affect communities?
>>    Do you not care that you will be late to work because
>>    there is an accident blocking your normal route?
>>    Do you not care that you will be ADDING
>>    to the problem (traffic) in the above case?
>>    Are you fine with going to the mall when
>>    there is an active shooter in the area?
>>    If there is a felon loose in your neighborhood,
>>    are you OK letting your kids go out to play?
>>    A FOIA request will not solve any of these cases.
>>    Encryption will not alert you to these cases.
>>    Only clear communications will let you know WHEN you need to know it.
>>    Joe M.
>>    On 11/9/2019 12:54 PM, Shawn Benoit wrote:
>>    > Sure, you can get access to police radio recordings by a FOI
>>    request (to
>>    > be nosy). No one except the police need real-time access to
>>    encrypted
>>    > communications. Problem solved.
> <>
>     Virus-free.
> <>
> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>

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